Is the GC a fail?

So since seeing one at the launch/show, I’ve yet to see one in the wild?
Almost six weeks in total of Euro wanderings this year and I’ve yet to see one!
Hundereds of Adria type Fiat/Citroen based Identivans but no GCs.

* No GC owners were offended during this post.

sidepod said:

So since seeing one at the launch/show, I’ve yet to see one in the wild?
Almost six weeks in total of Euro wanderings this year and I’ve yet to see one!
Hundereds of Adria type Fiat/Citroen based Identivans but no GCs.

* No GC owners were offended during this post.

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I know one GC owner and I'm offended for him. I'm tempted to report it

Ooooh! Too soon !

I don’t think the GC is a fail, the 2 models fill gaps previously unexplored by VW and they are very nice vehicles. I’ve seen a few around, and seen 2 new ones being collected at Breeze Poole, but it’s not the traditional halo California model that VW are known for and as such numbers will be far fewer.

I know the 680 hasn’t sold as many in the UK as the 600, but would be interested to know how many of each have indeed been registered.

I saw one on our recent 10 day trip. I also saw about 30 “normal” Calis in the same time period.

sidepod said:

So since seeing one at the launch/show, I’ve yet to see one in the wild?
Almost six weeks in total of Euro wanderings this year and I’ve yet to see one!
Hundereds of Adria type Fiat/Citroen based Identivans but no GCs.

* No GC owners were offended during this post.

Click to expand...

You sure you’re looking hard enough? They do tend to blend in easily.

I was in a field last weekend with 7 GC’s, a total of 8 including mine.

Argh finally saw one on my return journey from Wales the other weekend.

They do exist!

We are GC owners and on a 4 week trip through Poland, Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia we saw 5 (besides ours)- and 2 were from rental companies. We did see many other vans- I would say the most numerous was Mercedes/Sprinter- but there appeared to be far, far fewer vans in general compared to caravans and RVs- my assumption would be the cost, or it could just be preference.

When we were looking to buy here in Slovakia they haven't quite grasped that regular people want a camper van the size of the GC....they are seen as more of a business purpose- for those needing an office on wheels. I am not sure why this is....every RV/Womo/Caravan Dealer we went to tried to talk us out of a Camper Van (VW, Fiat, Adria, etc). We did find one used GC in Slovakia and again the salesman tried to talk us out of it- we were supposed to look at it at a Caravan show 2.5 hours from our house and he actually sent it back to his dealership (2 hours the other way) before we got to the show! We ended up driving to Dusseldorf Germany to pick up our used GC.

We are heading out soon on another 4-5 week trip- this time to Croatia, Slovenia and Italy...I will be counting GCs again!

We had a look around a campervan/motorhome retailer last week. They had new and used examples of most makes including a 21 plate VW GC 600. We were mainly interested in two berth vehicles that you can drive on a car license as I recently elected to surrender my C1 and D1 entitlements due to my rapidly approaching seventy. So the GC 600 was within our bracket. However, whilst it should have been an attractive proposition, we only gave it a quick glance before moving on. Why! We had previously visited our dealer to look at one and discounted it then and because in our opinion it only had two plus points in it's favour:

1. The whole thing is made by VW and warranted by them alone.
2. Build quality.

Beyond those two advantages, the interior design lets it down by being both awkward and a less than optimal use of available space when compared to some of the other vans in this large market sector. IMO, the central washroom is its biggest problem as it cuts the van in two both length and width ways creating a very awkward pinch point between the kitchen and the washroom door that would likely involve much shuffling and cursing.

The washroom itself appears to be one of those arrangements where absolutely everything gets wet and you need to spend the next hour drying everything off.

The two passenger seats are really only useful for two kids or very narrow adults who both like to sit bolt upright.

The fridge seems a daft design. Everytime you open it all the cold air disappears over the very low sides. And the list goes on......


Most of this awkwardness of design is brought about by the unnecessary need for a fixed bed in the rear, an issue that many of the other vans suffered from as well. The van that really won us over had the washroom at the rear which included a separate swing wall shower cubicle. The kitchen was also situated at the rear and was a proper kitchen arrangement. This left the rest of the interior as a large living space with comfortable seating for up to eight! Because there is no fixed bed to accomodate, this particular van has a spacious, light, airy and uncluttered feel about it. When it comes to bed time, yes, you do have to make up the bed or beds. There is a choice of two single beds or a super king sized double depending on your mood and neither arrangement takes more than a minute to set up. All this space is possible because the bed arrangements are combined with the living area. Frankly, when you have a finite amount of space to play with then it will always involve compromise of some kind. Having a fixed bed is essential to some but if you opt for this layout, the area that you will spent most of your time in usually becomes both cramped and cluttered.

So, "IS THE GC A FAIL?" Well only the sales figures will show whether it is or isn't. However, for us at least, there are much better alternatives on the market.

Borris said:

The van that really won us over ...

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I tend to agree with you about fixed beds wasting space, so which was the van that caught your fancy?

There does seem to be a higher proportion of Grand Cali accessories for sale in the various shops, which suggests they maybe overestimated demand. Whether this in turn means fewer GCs were sold than anticipated, who knows?

NickE said:

I tend to agree with you about fixed beds wasting space, so which was the van that caught your fancy?

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The one that we have decided to aim for is the Autosleepers Bourton. We just need to get all our financial "ducks in a row" first.


Ah ha! I hear you say, That's a motorhome not a large campervan like the GC. However, examine the specification of both and there isn't much of a difference.

Grand California 600
Length - 5.98m
Width - 2.04m
Height - 2.97m
Payload - 417kgs
Gross weight - 3.5t
2023 Price - £82,570

Autosleepers Bourton
Length - 6.49m
Width - 2.3m
Height - 2.9m
Payload - 520kgs
Gross weight - 3.5t
2023 Price - £97,000

Big diference in price? Actually no. The AS Bourton comes fully loaded at that price whereas the GC600 is the base price before options. By the time you have ticked the options list to bring the spec near to the AS van, the price is almost the same. So apart from the AS Bourton being slightly longer and wider the two vans are pretty much in the same arena. Another bonus is that the Mercedes Benz van offers free roadside assistance for 30years providing you always use MB to carry out the servicing.

Yes, I prefer the build quality of the VW product but the AS product is extremely good as well. There are even less old fashioned fabric options that give the Bourton's interior a more up market contemporary feel. However, leaving all that aside, it is the simple, spacious layout that we like.

Borris said:

The one that we have decided to aim for is the Autosleepers Bourton. We just need to get all our financial "ducks in a row" first.

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Nice!

Borris said:

The one that we have decided to aim for is the Autosleepers Bourton. We just need to get all our financial "ducks in a row" first.


Ah ha! I hear you say, That's a motorhome not a large campervan like the GC. However, examine the specification of both and there isn't much of a difference.

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Thats probably as good as you can get if you want a 2 seater motorhome.

That 300mm difference in width is massive when it comes to driving narrow roads.

What you don't get is the huge side opening door, that really brings the outside in or the inside out, & means that space under the awning feels really joined to the inside space. It means the whole set up feels like a sociable kitchen diner.
The bit we rally liked on the GC was being able to stand up & cook in front of that huge opening & being able to get drinks out of the fridge without having to climb in the van. It means the whole set up feels like a sociable kitchen diner.

Borris said:

The AS Bourton comes fully loaded at that price whereas the GC600 is the base price before options. By the time you have ticked the options list to bring the spec near to the AS van, the price is almost the same.

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What options are you adding to get anywhere near that? its £81,890 + Reversing cam + solar = £84k ok you are missing the £250 Avtex TV but with DTD you are down to £75k the AS is £22k more & you don't get an outside table or chairs!

£22k is a huge difference not almost the same.

andyinluton said:

Thats probably as good as you can get if you want a 2 seater motorhome.

That 300mm difference in width is massive when it comes to driving narrow roads.

What you don't get is the huge side opening door, that really brings the outside in or the inside out, & means that space under the awning feels really joined to the inside space. It means the whole set up feels like a sociable kitchen diner.
The bit we rally liked on the GC was being able to stand up & cook in front of that huge opening & being able to get drinks out of the fridge without having to climb in the van. It means the whole set up feels like a sociable kitchen diner.

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All interesting and valid points and I do get the "bringing the outside in" thing.

Just to be clear though, if we do end up getting one...and a long term plan has already been hatched, then it would be instead of our second car but not our seven seat Beach. That was always intended as a long term proposition, that has proved itself to be far too useful to part with. So if we do feel the need to tour exploring narrow lanes then it'll continue to be our glorious Beach. The AS B van is also intended for touring but with more emphasis on the parking up and lounging. That's what happens when you get older. Your knees pack up and beige starts to look strangely attractive.

Yes, it is wider but I have driven fire trucks in the dim and distant so don't see that as a major issue. We always used to recon that the faster you went the thinner the vehicle became. Seriously though, I will be avoiding the very narrow lanes for fear of scratching the bodywork.

I see the two as different type of vans, the GC looks perfect for summer where you live mainly outside & just come in to sleep.
The AS to me is more your rainy day / winter camper with a nice place to lounge whilst you decide what to watch on the TV next.

andyinluton said:

What options are you adding to get anywhere near that? its £81,890 + Reversing cam + solar = £84k ok you are missing the £250 Avtex TV but with DTD you are down to £75k the AS is £22k more & you don't get an outside table or chairs!

£22k is a huge difference not almost the same.

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I'm merely quoting the 2023 brochure prices before any discounts. The discounted pricing picture may weIl look different depending on the demand for and availabilty of each vehicle.

If you look at the entire GC options list and compare it to the kit that comes with the Mercedes AS B, in order to compare like with like, then yes, the GC is cheaper but not by very much.

You do get a large table with the AS that can be used both inside and outside. As for the VW seats, if the ones in the GC are the same as those in the standard Cali then frankly, I rather supply my own.

andyinluton said:

I see the two as different type of vans, the GC looks perfect for summer where you live mainly outside & just come in to sleep.
The AS to me is more your rainy day / winter camper with a nice place to lounge whilst you decide what to watch on the TV next.

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Precisely.

Borris said:

The one that we have decided to aim for is the Autosleepers Bourton. We just need to get all our financial "ducks in a row" first.

Ah ha! I hear you say, That's a motorhome not a large campervan like the GC. However, examine the specification of both and there isn't much of a difference.

Grand California 600
Length - 5.98m
Width - 2.04m
Height - 2.97m
Payload - 417kgs
Gross weight - 3.5t
2023 Price - £82,570

Autosleepers Bourton
Length - 6.49m
Width - 2.3m
Height - 2.9m
Payload - 520kgs
Gross weight - 3.5t
2023 Price - £97,000

Big diference in price? Actually no. The AS Bourton comes fully loaded at that price whereas the GC600 is the base price before options. By the time you have ticked the options list to bring the spec near to the AS van, the price is almost the same. So apart from the AS Bourton being slightly longer and wider the two vans are pretty much in the same arena. Another bonus is that the Mercedes Benz van offers free roadside assistance for 30years providing you always use MB to carry out the servicing.

Yes, I prefer the build quality of the VW product but the AS product is extremely good as well. There are even less old fashioned fabric options that give the Bourton's interior a more up market contemporary feel. However, leaving all that aside, it is the simple, spacious layout that we like.

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It's a Gran Cali Killer!
Totally agree with your analysis. That double sofa area is huge and you can spend hours if it needs be, without the claustrophobics sensation offered by 95% of all other RVs with the dinette squeezed between Bathroom and front seats, only to leave a huge unused bedroom at the back.
The only downside, it seem to lack a place for storage for outdoor chairs, levelling ramps, barbeque, that sort of stuff. Probably there must be some storage underneath at least one of the bed/sofa.
Love it actually.

We’ve looked at all of this size of van and can’t get excited about any of them.

iSmove it has to be

Borris said:

The one that we have decided to aim for is the Autosleepers Bourton. We just need to get all our financial "ducks in a row" first.

[

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Very nice Borris, I love Autosleepers, British made (owned by Trigano now I think) and British layout with excellent build quality.

I would have gone for one but I am the opposite to you. The fixed bed, small dinette was my "must-have". I am often on my own and have plenty of room to stretch out when wanted and most of my lifestyle involves being out all day and coming home for somewhere to sit, work, cook and sleep all with the total minimum of fuss.

I do drool at AS though. Something very traditional about them with an excellent reputation and really went through hoops wondering if I could accomodate making the bed up each night.

Lovely!

I don’t think it’s the fixed bed that’s the issue. It’s the bathroom.
They’re all very small and take up a lot of living space. It’s something that’s used for a very small percentage of time when living in the van.

Currently looking at a Crafter self/bespoke build, without a bathroom.

soulstyledevon said:

I don’t think it’s the fixed bed that’s the issue. It’s the bathroom.
They’re all very small and take up a lot of living space. It’s something that’s used for a very small percentage of time when living in the van.

Currently looking at a Crafter self/bespoke build, without a bathroom.

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I came across this the other day and thought it looked pretty interesting.
We’re a family of 4 and that RIB bed looks a lot more practical for a couple of kids than the cab bunk in a GC600…